The Denver Spiderman

0:02 Hello, Bizarre Story friends, You've tuned into the Bizarre AF, a place where we talk about the strange, the unusual, the unknown, and all things bizarre AF. I'm Kevin. I'm going to be your host for today's episode. As always, we ask that you keep an open mind, keep a skeptical ear, but keep listening to the facts as we take you on our newest Spooktacular story, Denver Spider Man. Well hello my bizarre besties.

1:04 Please help and welcome my Co Hostess with the mostess Alicia. Hey, girl. Hey. Hi. Hi. Hi. Whoa, whoa, I said. I was so far away, and then I just ran right up here. Wow. I know how. You doing? I'm doing good. I'm doing good girl, how are you? Good, good. No spooky season. October we love. Oh my God, I I love, I love the spooky, I love the scary. Give me all the ghost stories. Like honestly. Anything. Anything. Anything yeah and, and give me like, like what's what's interesting like we were talking about like, honestly, we could probably do a different topic every single day. That's like scary.

1:47 It's just like scary and spooky, but I love, I love the cool weather. I love like getting all bundled up and getting, I love fall clothes. Oh my God, yes. I'm so excited. So spiders are creepy. You know what I'm not very scared of? Spiders No. No, but don't they look kind of creepy though? Especially like tarantulas. And they're like long spindly legs, I. Like. The way that they move. Exactly. And, and they go, they're they, they go hand in hand with Halloween. They do, absolutely. So I thought this, this, this fits, this fits our, our theme this month. And you remember the story about the Tylenol murders? Remember that.

2:29 I do, yeah. Remember how they found a dismembered body in the attic? I do remember that, yes. Do you remember there's a couple of bizarre news story episodes back and I talked about all of the string of murders and crazy people living in attics and under beds. Oh my God, do you? Remember that? Yes. Yes, yes, well, this nightmare. Fuel. I have another one for you. I'm. So excited. I'm so excited for this story. So I know you have heard of the Denver Spider Man. I love this story, Yes. Yeah, you probably know the whole did the general story, but there's a few deets that I found that kind of put a little bit more context into his behaviour. Oh, OK.

3:21 I don't know about that. Yeah, good. Since, and I think some of this will be will be new for you yes you know what's also funny is that there's a couple of episodes of very popular television shows that were inspired by the Denver spider man. There was ACSI episode called Stalker and there was a Simpsons episode called The Ziff Who Came to Denver and those were two episodes are based around Dimmer Spider Man. I had no idea, right? Yeah. Yeah, now I wanna go watch. I haven't watched him, but I wanna go watch. Yeah. Same. I like a Simpsons episode. Come on. Right. Oh my God. OK.

4:01 Right. I can't believe South Park hasn't done it, to be quite honest. I'm, I'm actually real, I'm shocked that they haven't. Well, I guess they have some really great material right now that's happening. Kind of taking part. Yeah, like like that's, that's in the. We got enough material, yeah. When we don't have an idea, we'll use Denver Spider Man. Yeah, that's a great point. OK, so I'm going to, I'm going to tell y'all about Denver Spider Man. And again, it's just another bizarre AF story in our arsenal of crazy because we got, I mean, and you've particularly have made pages and pages and pages and pages and pages of topics. This is just one pulled out-of-the-box. Hundreds.

4:42 Yes. So we're going to go back to the late 1800s. OK. Theodore Konis was born November 10th, 1882 in Pittsburgh, Illinois. Thomas Konis, born in 1844, married in Canadian. It was a Canadian. He was a Canadian, Never Grant. And he owned a hardware store in Petersburg. And his wife, Isabella Ellum, I think El AM, she was born in 1851 and they were the parents of Theodore, right? OK. Immigrant roots. Yep, Yep.

5:24 So Thomas, which is Theodore's dad, dies in 1888. And so Isabella and Theodore end up moving around, but they end up going to Denver, come to Denver color, or should say come to Denver, Co around 1898, where she worked as a housekeeper at what was called the Denver Democratic Club. Oh, OK. Now, Theodore suffered from poor health his whole life. In fact, he had been told by doctors to not expect to live past her 18th birthday. And because of this, theater decides, well, then why do I go to school? I'm not even going to go to school. Like, what's the point, right?

6:11 I'm gonna enjoy life. Enjoy life. Yeah. So Theodore was actually quite good at the mandolin. Oh, the instrument, yeah. And he would walk the streets of Denver playing anywhere he really could to make money. Because he didn't have an education. Right, exactly because he didn't have much of A choice. Right, right. He's gonna die by before 18. Yep. And his, you know, he didn't have the diploma and his mother wouldn't let him work because of his condition. Because he's incredibly sickly, not like. Incredibly sickly. Yeah, it's not like this kid, you know, You're like, OK, make sure you're all buttoned up and you don't catch a cold cover your chest. Like she was like the ultimate hover parent, right?

6:53 Totally. I lost my my husband. I'm not going to lose the only thing that I have tied to my husband. Right. And she's going to let you know she's going to lose him soon. So yeah, totally protective. So in 1899, Theodore is 17 years old. We'll call him Theo. Yeah, Theo. And a man by the name of Philip Peters had just started his career at a Denver, the Denver Railroad office, and he had a brand new bride and he purchased a new bungalow on a quiet St. in Denver's Middle North Side. And if you're at all familiar with Denver, that area is now what we refer to as Highland. The Highland.

7:36 And it is now kind. It's like hipster Poshy. Oh yeah, these are the like, even the shittiest looking house is like $1,000,000. Yeah. Like these, these are it's, it's beyond his. It's like it's totally posh. Like that is like one of the hottest neighborhoods to live in. Yeah. You know the the young like. Walk around, go go in your neighborhood. Holding your phone on you know, and you have your little. Coffee your. Little Louis Vuitton bag and you're walking to a shop and. Yes. And you're and you're Pataguchi with your designer dog. Like in the in the corner. You're like, oh, hey, yeah, yeah. I live in the Highlands.

8:20 I I'm paying like over $1,000,000 for my house, but I have no parking. There's no parking. Oh God, that right. There's no parking in that neighborhood and and very few people have garages. These are all old. Homes and the developers don't want to put garages because they need the space for all of their freaking apartments. Exactly. Exactly. It's so Philip Peters and his wife would host people at their home and they called it the Mandolin Club because they wanted to learn how to play and their their friends wanted to learn how to play. And Theo lands this gig giving them mandolin lessons.

9:02 Great, the one thing he knows how to do right. Because remember, he can't get a job because mummy won't let him work so. And he's sickly, he's going to die and. He can play the mandolin. So yeah, we're making money. So he the more he comes to their home and, you know, is teaching them the mandolin, the more he kind of starts to resent and hate Philip for really his success and ultimately his life, his wife, his home, like, everything. He becomes completely resentful and jealous, right? He, like, thinks he has everything and he's about to die. So yeah, he gets very resentful. Sure.

9:43 At this point, remember, he thinks he has less than a year to live. I guess he's 17. Yeah. Oh, yes. Yes, yes, yes, yes. Right. And there were many, many nights in the fall of 1899 when Thea was actually the only guest at their house, and one night the Peters had asked him to dine with them. Will you dine with us? He told them he had not finished high school, that his mother wouldn't let him get a job and how he was going to die very, very soon. He told them all about his boyhood in Illinois and how his father died when he was really young and an infant.

10:28 Really talked about how he really wanted to play ball, but that wasn't good for his heart, so he couldn't play ball. And that really how he ultimately hated people for staring and laughing at him because he looked sickly. He looked sickly and he wanted to live by himself where he couldn't, you know, hear people judging and mocking him. Oh my God, He's like the best dinner guest ever. Yeah. Like this is great. We're so happy we made this fucking meal and are just sitting here listening to you right. Oh my God, he sounds like an insult. Doesn't he sound like a joy? He sounds like like a red pillar. He sounds like one of those those people who just like blames the world for all of their their issues. He's bitter, bitter, bitter.

11:12 Bitter, bitter man. Yes. And you know, like, they're so nice to give him one a job, but then to say, hey, why don't you come on over? You seem a little fucking weird. We're going to try to like befriend you and take pity on you because you're a weirdo. And we are good people with good. Hearts. Exactly. So ultimately, the lessons stop. They're like, oh, this is who you are. Several years later, it's a snowy evening when Phil Peters was leaving work. He brushed shoulders with this slender, shabby figure.

11:55 And guess who it was? Theo. Oh, Theo. He tells Phil how his mother had lost their money to some men who had talked her into selling property in Illinois. That property that they had they owned in Illinois and investing in a mine in the foothills of Denver, but they never saw them again, so they lost all of their money. Oh, my God. So Peters invites him to dinner again, and Theo tells him that really, he's doing his best to take care of his mother. You know, he has to take care of his mother. And that he got a job at an advertising firm down in downtown Denver. Oh nice. Evening finishes, they part ways again.

12:37 The next time Phil sees Theo was in the spring of 1912. So we are 12 years later. So you're telling me he didn't die when he? Was didn't die when he was 18. Oh God, could you imagine? Like, like you're building up and you're thinking I'm gonna die. I'm gonna die in less than a year and like, I'm just gonna live life to the fullest. And it just keeps dragging and dragging and dragging. I'm gonna die any minute. I'm gonna die any minute. Die any minute. No wonder. Why he was like the epitome of like macabre Eeyore you're. Right. Exactly like this guy's like super like Downer, like Debbie Downer, Theo Downer, you know, like, like he was just like super not great. And and at least he now has.

13:23 But it's like one of those things like you think about, OK, he keeps on like saying all this negative stuff and all this negative stuff starts happening to him or is continues to happen to him. So it's like he's just focusing on that and not like the hey, it's great. I got a job and, you know, advertising downtown Denver even though I didn't even have like a degree or graduate from high school. Go to school. Like he could have made something of himself, no doubt. Absolutely. So this is spring of 1912 and Theo tells feel that his mother had died the previous year, so 1911, and that he's just he's kept living, not expecting to live. And he just he never knew what to do because he just was never expecting to live this long.

14:05 He hadn't planned like nothing, right? So again, they part ways during the next few decades. Theo is all over the place. OK. He tries to get into the Army, but with his health, right, They're actually literally laughing him out the room. Like are you Cray Cray Boo? No way. Yeah, you can't do anything. He somehow manages to go to California where he lives like a complete hobo under this bridge. It was like like all jungly and stuff. He lived there. He would find total shit holes in flip houses, flop houses to live in.

14:45 Just like a total homeless person. He drifts state to state to state, actually ends up back in New York to try to become a salesman that ultimately fails. He gives that up and ends up coming back to Denver in September of 1941. Oh my God, this guy. So the guy's living and living and living and living. I mean, and he's living on the streets. He's not nearly as sickly as they thought he was. What the hell? And he can't be healthy living like a homeless person. No, underneath the bridge. Yeah. Yeah, he was. Literally his body was doing way better than people thought. He's literally a troll under the bridge.

15:26 Yes, like, exactly what I mean. Yeah, and he keeps on living. Crazy. Totally crazy. Crazy. Can't even have life. So this is September 1941. So a neighbor of Phil Peters had been preparing dinners at her house for Phil because his wife had broken a hip a couple weeks prior and she was in the hospital. OK. And this was October, an evening in in October of 41, and he never shows up to pick up the meal. And the neighbor knew that he had personally not been doing well without his wife at home. And so she went to go see if he was all right. But no one came to the door when she was ringing the doorbell. And it was dark.

16:19 And so she goes and grabs other neighbors and says, hey, you know, Phil's not answering. Come to the house with me. And, and this helped me figure out, you know, it feels OK. And so they all tried the doors. They were all locked as well as the window screens. But a girl did find one screen, loosened it and pried open the window so she was able to climb inside. So she enters the the dark, dark house and then suddenly they all just hear her scream. And she found Phil Peters dead on the floor. And he was 7073 years old at this time. So when the police arrive they discover his body in the downstairs bedroom. He was bloody, half dressed, barefooted and had been beaten and beaten and beaten.

17:12 Oh my God. And clearly beaten long after he was dead. I did not know this. So. This is. Personal if you, if you want. Bingo. If you watch any TV at all in these crime shows, you know that when people murder people that way, it's personal. It's not just some random murder or house robbery. It is personal. Yeah. And they're pretty sure Phil never even knew what hit him. That's they're pretty sure about that. Oh well, thank God for that. They found his watch and his money laying on a dresser, so they knew no one's.

17:54 Robbery. Yeah. No one stole anything. No one stole anything. They beat the shit out of him even after he was dead. So, OK, all right, at least we kind of have an idea that someone he knew, someone that hated him. Has a vendetta against him some like 70 year old man like so weird. So here's where it gets creepy AF. OK. So the front and the back door was locked, but the front door was also secured with a chain. This is when the when they arrive. Right. Which means that how could you murder someone, leave, and then chain the door? Yes, yes.

18:39 And they found 2 cast iron shakers and they do. You know what cast iron shaker is? You know what Shaker is and the old time the stoves, especially when you had wood stoves, they had these things that you would shake them and it would put the, send the coals down into a bucket and so that you could take the bucket and empty the coals. And they're, they're called shakers and they're generally made out of cast iron cause those ovens were made out of cast iron and they're big. So they're, you know, about like that, like maybe a foot by, I don't know, 8 inches, 10 inches, maybe maybe they're longer, 14 inches. So it's, it's kind of big. Yeah. So they find two of those shakers in the kitchen, one that had lots of dust and ash on it, and the other one was clean. And they also find a damp towel with blood stains on it. And so the police start profiling the murder and they come to the conclusion that this guy was must be a big guy. Like they're calling him blood crazy. Like thirsty.

19:50 Crazy. Bloodlust, big guy and that, or her and that. He or she had completely vanished without a trace. This is what they're left. With. Well, yeah, like this seems like a ghostly apparition, like, came in to to kill. And, you know, you hear about this all the time. Like it's defying any kind of understanding we have if everything's still locked on the inside of the house, Like. Yeah. What? How the hell did they get out? Yeah, yeah, How did they get out and what kind of like crazy ass like magic is? I don't know that like I'd be like there has to like there's no other way. There's no like intruder. It's not like they have like, you know, tarred footsteps or muddy footsteps or bloody footsteps going out the door, which I'm assuming that if they're if the if those guy was beat so bad and even after the fucking he's dead.

20:44 Like how is there not any kind of evidence of an intruder leaving? There has to be blood all over the place. And they've searched the house. They searched the house. They actually even see, you know how in the house you have a attic, like in the closets, you have a hole to get up in the attic. I even saw that, but it was tiny. It was tiny. It's not like someone could be hiding up there. And they even pushed it. It was like they couldn't open it. So, and they searched this house. Nothing, absolutely nothing is in there. And so now it's January of 1942. This is a couple of months after Phil's murder. Bitter cold day, temperature below 0, which it had been for many days.

21:27 There's this group of children, they're hurrying by the bungalow going to school, and they report seeing a light inside the house. And just days before that, another neighbor reported she had seen this ghostly face inside the shadowy window. I mean, come on, ghostly apparition, we. Love it. Everyone is convinced in the neighborhood that the the house, this house is haunted. Yeah. So once Missus Peters recovers, she decided to return to that house that had been her home for 50 years. Oh my God, yeah. And so one night, something startled her. She fell. Ree broke her hip.

22:09 Oh my God. I mean, she's an old, old lady. Osteoporosity, you know. What, so she didn't want to go back to the hospital so she ends up hiring a full time nurse? Understandable. To live with her. And one night this nurse asked Misses Peters is if her house is haunted. And she said, of course it's not. But the nurse tells Misses Peters that she hears rattling noises inside the house. She can't figure out where it's coming from, but she's hearing these rattling noises. So they tell the police. And after another thorough investigation, they're finding nothing. And a few days later, the nurse reports what she called a spook on the back stairs that chattered its teeth at her. You know, like.

23:00 My God, that's that is the last thing you would want to see. No thank you. No thank you. Holy shit. So she immediately resigns. OK, I don't care how much these people are paying me, I am not staying. Here, Mama gone. Yeah, someone's doing this, chattering their teeth at me, and I'm hearing shit like in this house, this woman's husband just died. I don't care how broken this woman's hip is, it is not worth me also dying. Exactly, exactly. That's the first. Thing it's haunted. Could God?

23:40 And the neighborhood was very, very tight knit. Lots of caring neighbors. So one of the close neighbors stepped in to help instead. Makes sense. Several days later than that neighborhood believes, she heard a mysterious noise, and without turning on the light, she hurried into the kitchen to investigate, where she saw a quote ghost at the foot of the stairs. You know. And she told investigators that it was like a filthy wrath like thing that vanished when she screamed and she had no idea where it went.

24:21 This is, it's like one of those things you're like, is this, is this like, are these apparitions? Are these things happening because people are just paying more attention to it now or like what's going on here? What's? Going on. Like, it's like all of this action, this energy is happening around the same time. Yeah. But also is the woman who like now lives in the house A7 year old woman? Is she hearing these things or seeing? These misses Peters. Misses Peters like is Misses Peters actually like, well, she's bad. She's hearing some, which is what caused her to refracture her hip right she's. Hearing some so she's saying there is something going on. Yeah, but she's just not sure. Also, she's staying in her house. She's. Kind of one of those people that just don't want to leave their 50 year old home, right? They're just like, fuck that.

25:05 I'm not letting some ghost kick me out of my house. I guess I get it. The police decide to They're going to keep a watch on the House. We're just going to watch the house now. And finally misses Peters relatives through insisting, insisting, insisting, insisting. Finally get her to go live with her son in western Colorado. Not entirely sure, probably like Grand Junction or something. Right now the house is empty. It's now July 1942, and two men from the Denver Police Department were stationed on the lookout across the street from the house. The sun was starting to get low and as there was a postman that was making his deliveries and the policeman had been watching him when one of them sees what he called a hobgoblin like face in the opening between the curtains in the bungalow. And so he elbows the other guy go hey, hey, hey, hey. And he sees it and it freaks him, obviously the F out. So the two policemen take off across the street and one of them was blowing their whistles back when they had whistles in. The window vanishes as they're running out to the house, and so they bust in the door with their shoulders. Yes, a furniture all covered in sheets. There's old magazines laying all over the place. It was dark, it was musky.

26:39 And they see this portrait that's hanging over the piano, and it was of this kind of tall, frail, sickly looking, thin man with a turtleneck sweater holding a mandolin. OK, 11 the the ghost came out and created had a had a painting created of him like like or or this is the haunting of like this. They were the first the this family was the first ones to own the house, right? I don't think that that's necessarily true. OK, I mean, but there weren't a ton of. Family. I mean, it could have been, but yeah. Yeah, it's not like they had like it's, it's been a house that's been around for generations. Yeah, right.

27:26 It's not that. They're one of like the first yeah owners. So no doubt we can't like look at it and be like this was some kind of like French. Ancient, yeah. Yeah, yeah, what the hell? So the two men begin to search the lower level, and they're complaining the whole time that the rooms reek of some, like, gross animal stench. There were more police coming to help them. They head upstairs just in time to see a closet door close. And so the cop opens the closet door and he sees that are two bare feet kind of kicking violently from the ceiling. And he ends up grabbing these trousers and his feet. And of course, he's kicking, kicking, kicking, kicking. And the cop grabs his pants leg, but it rips off. And so the the legs are starting to go up. And so then he grabs the ankle and he pulls really hard. And they just hear the scream in the attic. Yeah, and they finally get him down and it's just real, like scarecrow of a man, like gaunt, thin, like skin and bones, totally tattered clothes, filthy bare feet. His hair is completely tangled and he's now laying outstretched on the bedroom floor, unconscious because of this pain, I guess.

28:56 Probably knocked him unconscious or in the fall or something. Yeah. So the police captain orders them to get a doctor and an ambulance because the man was like barely alive and clearly he was malnourished and starved. Like skin and bones, skin and bones person. So they take a look at the hole, and it was a hole that was just about, you know, how big a cigar box is. You know, it's about like, what is that at 12 inches by, I don't know, eight or something? It's not very big. Yeah, like smaller than a, than a shoebox, like maybe a children's shoebox or something. They said it was no bigger than three of those put together. It was a tiny, tiny hole.

29:40 One of them tried to get through that hole himself and couldn't even possibly get through that hole. But he could see in the space up there, and there was this little bitty room that was maybe a few sizes bigger than a coffin. I mean, he said it was small. They found a small bulb hanging from a wire, overpowering animal stench. And he can make out a bed that was made out of an old ironing board. Oh. My God. Magazines in the corners and the corners were infested with spiders. Yeah. So once the man regains consciousness, they take him to police headquarters and that's where this man starts telling them this story.

30:27 Oh my I'm I am waiting for this motherfucker. This like weird ass gross Wraith like person. So this was this came out of the police report. OK. And this is him speaking. Everything would have been all right and Phil Peters would have been alive today if he hadn't caught me in the icebox. It was him or me. I thought he had gone out, but he was actually taking a nap. I hit him with the stove shaker when he tried to run for help. I don't know if he recognized me. It was nearly 30 years since I had seen him last, and when it was over, I ran to the attic after I washed and dried the shaker.

31:18 I was sitting on the trap door when you guys were pounding on it from below that night that you found him, which is why they couldn't open that hole that they found. He was sitting on it. He was sitting on it. And you know what, when you're trying to like, you know, yeah, push something up like that, it's harder to do. Yeah, you don't have leverage. You don't have enough leverage, Yeah. So he goes on. I was in the neighborhood in September of 1941 and found the house unlocked and no one home. I went in to steal some food. I was in really bad shape. My lungs were giving me a lot of trouble and I was at the end of my rope.

32:00 Fall was coming on and I couldn't face another winter on the road. I had to find a place to stay. I didn't know Missus Peters was in the hospital. I found the hole in the closet, climbed through and slept for a few days. Whenever I heard him downstairs, I kept really still. As time went on, I got bolder, and I used to shadow him from room to room. It was sort of a game. It gave me a thrill. It was the first time in my life I had ever had anyone at my mercy. But I didn't want to hurt him.

32:44 It was miserable hot in the summer in that attic, and my feet froze in the dead of winter in that attic. But it was all part of the price I was willing to pay. I can't tell you why I stuck it out. I guess it was mostly because it was a world all my own. I used to go down and look out the windows and watch the postman come by. Nobody has written in 25 years. When I saw people on the street, I hated them and would go back to my attic. I mean, we said he was bitter.

33:28 He. Bitter, creepy, creepy. Like deranged, just angry at the world. Yes. And like, I hate, I hate that I'm going to even say this. I kind of feel bad for. Him, you do start to feel bad for him. Isn't that weird? You do you, have you? Have way more yes, sympathy and empathy because you're like, well, it sounds like what an awful way to live your life and this is your reality and like, it just sucks that like you're like who you are as a person is so broken and so.

34:10 But the left up part is the hymns like creeping behind him ringed a room while. I'm going to, you know, bring my spindly long arms and creep. You Can you imagine knowing someone was following you in your inner own house? I was just creepy. OK, OK, I would get. I would not give up, but like you cannot trust anything anymore like I would have not that something would break inside of me. I would be like Charles the the Mad King. So. Paranoid, I would be so paranoid and then like like the place that you have known your as your home for 50 years.

34:58 It's so. Violated SO. Violated and by someone that you like, some random ass person you knew like over 20 years ago that you thought was fucking creepy and you kind of fired in the past. Like, like you took pity on like these people took pity on this man. Trying to be nice. So sad. So the local newspaper dubbed him the Sneaky Sneaky Spider Man of Denver after the police detective Fred Zaro remarked a man would have to be a spider to stay up there that long. I mean a spider is being generous with with him. Well, they figured, you know, it was the room was covered in spiders, so and he tolerated them. So that's kind of how he got his nickname. So Theo was also known as Matthew Cornish. 5 foot 10135 lbs.

35:55 And now well past 60. 5/10 1:30 That's very, very small and. Tried and convicted and then sentenced to life imprisonment at the Colorado State Penitentiary in Canyon City, Colorado on November 18th, 1942. He died at the prison hospital on May 16th, 1967, well past his 18th birthday. Oh my God dude was like close to 80 or was he 80? Yeah, yeah. So born in what was it? What did we say? 99 or no, what did we say?

36:38 He was born. 80 I thought it was like. 80 Theodore was born in 1882. 82 to 60, Yeah, He was like, in his 70s. Yeah, yeah. Wait, OK. That that is just like a lesson. And never assume the worst if you assume the worship. Of that energy, it's never give up. Never give up. Never give up, just. When you think that you're at your end and you can't possibly pull out of it, don't. Don't give up. This guy gave up, or else you're going to live like a fucking Wildman, that is. For 60 years. An animal. An animal. That guy became an animal. A bitter, angry person killed someone who showed him kindness, terrorized, you know, his wife. Like like these people were kind to him and he just he resented them and like and and thought that they were somehow an in his mercy.

37:34 Like that's like deranged, like UN just messed up. Messed up. Screw that guy. I kind of want to see some pictures of him though too. Like, yeah, yeah, I'll put a link. I think I found that there's a Denver news article that I had found that talked about it originally. So yeah, I'll try to put that in the notes so people can take a look at. It by the way, not to be creepy, but you know you can find this house is still standing in Denver. I actually, I have like walked past it with friends. We're like, we're in the neighborhood. Let's like go. And and so we like walked past it and like the light in the attic turned on. I was like, Oh my God, I like ran through. But people live there so don't like bother them. But you know, you can cruise by.

38:26 It's still, it's still up. So were there facts that you hadn't heard before in this story? Yeah, yeah, there were. There were a ton of facts I hadn't heard. Yeah, great. It still creeps me out. I'm so happy we didn't talk about it like earlier. Oh God. Cool. Well, thanks for listening to my story and we'll see you in a couple weeks. Yes, thank you. So much, it was so fun. Great. All right. See you. Everybody see you. Bye.